Sep 1 2009

Portland Cement Problems After Skim Coating A Patio Slab

Let’s Learn About the Right vs. Wrong Way to Resurface
Existing Concrete Patio Surfaces

I received this email from Trisha asking me:

I have encountered a problem on my patio. After much research your website was the only one that made it clear there was a difference between concrete and cement.

We have a slab in our back yard (like a river rock slab), we wanted to skim it over with a smooth layer. We did so with what the hardware store told us to do it with, which was Portland cement. But it came out with lots of cracks and you can scratch your fingernail in it.

Is it because we used cement and not concrete?

My reply:

Hi Trisha:
First, thank you for telling me how you found my website. Glad my concrete-vs-cement page helped you.

Next … the easiest way to explain cement vs. concrete: cement is the dry, powdery product; once it is mixed with water and aggregate, it is called “concrete”. So no, your problem wasn’t in the terminology … your problem was a very ill-informed salesperson. :x

What a shame! You were given horribly wrong information!!! Even I know that you can’t put pure Portland cement onto a concrete (or rock) slab! And I’m no concrete expert by any means.

**First … I seriously suggest that you go back and confront the store manager about what happened because you’re not going to like my answer, meaning this isn’t going to be an easy “fix”, nor cheap. (Unless you clean off the crumbling Portland and forget about doing anything further.)

Let me tell you that the husband of a very close friend of mine was a professional concrete finisher and I picked his brain for you … and in a nutshell, here are some guidelines I can offer you:

  1. Portland cement CANNOT be used all by itself in this situation! it needs some kind of aggregate added to it … so this was mistake #1;
  2. You cannot just put a “skim coat” onto the slab … you need at the minimum a 2″ thick “layer” of concrete … so here was mistake #2;
  3. The slab must be prepped with a “bonding agent” … this allows the new concrete to adhere to the slab … mistake #3;
  4. There very well might be the need for the bonding agent to also be mixed into the new concrete;
  5. The slab might possibly need to be wet down, before the bonding agent is applied;
  6. You should use a 5-sack mix (called 5000 lb concrete);
  7. The new concrete needs to be kept moist for 28-days – it will reach about 90% of it’s full cure (hardness) in that time frame – spray it down with your hose every day & night to dampen – this will help it to not crack and cure properly;
  8. And then seal with a good quality concrete sealer after the 28 days.

And before any new concrete can be laid, you are going to have to THOROUGHLY clean/scrape off all the flaking Portland cement.

PLEASE NOTE: There could be other things to take into consideration before attempting this concrete project. I DO NOT know the particulars. There are many variables when it comes to concrete and the specific project.

***Bottom line … I suggest you call a reputable professional concrete company to add the smooth “layer” for you. Forms have to be built along the outside edges to hold in the concrete; expansion joints may need to be added into the wet concrete; depending on the size of the slab, interior wire “mesh” might need to be laid to help it not crack; the top must be finished off correctly to make it smooth, etc.

Does this overview of things-to-do help you? I hate to hear of problems like this. If nothing else, you deserve all your money back for whatever supplies and such that you bought for this project!

~~~

Trisha wrote back:

Thank you very much Claudia. Your info is extremely helpful!

We must be on the right track because yesterday we bought that same 5000 concrete mix and blended it with the Portland cement. It made a smooth finish like we wanted. It does not have the best appearance but it bonded and it is concrete. HA!

It is just a small 16 x 20 fenced in back patio, so anything done to the slab is better than what it looked like before.

Again thank you for all your info.


May 30 2009

Concrete Reacts Differently With Various Metals

Be Aware Of How Portland Cement Or Mortar
In Your Recipe Will React To Various Metals

I received a question from a crafter who had read my post about using hypertufa to skim coat vertical walls. She has a metal shed that she’d like to use the technqiue on and wondered if it would work in her situation.

I told her I’d found and saved some information years ago about this very issue and would post it. So … here it is. Anyone who works with a hypertufa or concrete recipe and uses a metal mold, or has something else made from metal that will be embedded into the ‘tufa or ‘crete needs to be aware of this information.

Aluminum
Embedded aluminum roof flashing, aluminum water stops, aluminum electrical conduit, introduced aluminum powder (sometimes used to foam concrete), or embedded structural aluminum shapes may all corrode in concrete or mortar. In all cases, a reaction that forms aluminum hydroxide and hydrogen gas occurs, and may cause expansion and cracking of the concrete or mortar. The common use of calcium chloride (or other alkali compounds), and dampness of the concrete increases the reaction rate. Usually, coating the aluminum with bituminous paint, impregnated paper or felt, plastic, or an alkali-resistant coating will prevent or sharply reduce the corrosion.

Copper
Copper embedded in concrete and/or mortar is usually roof flashing. Embedded copper is practically immune to reaction with corrosive alkalis, even if exposed to constant moisture. Copper will not react with dry, hardened concrete and/or mortar. Rainwater leaching, however, may bring chlorides in contact with the metal. Corrosion may occur and result in a green discoloration or runoff. Consequently, chloride admixtures should not be used in concrete if contact with copper is expected.

Lead
Lead will always corrode when in contact with fresh concrete and/or mortar. The high pH from calcium hydroxide is the cause of the corrosion. Cured, seasoned concrete or mortar will not react with lead. Corrosion of embedded lead flashing in mortar joints will usually result in the production of a lead oxide, a white discoloration. A special case of lead corrosion, called differential aeration, occurs when a lead strip is partially embedded in concrete so that part of the strip is exposed to air. The embedded section has a different electrical potential than the section exposed to air. The result is that the strip will become polar in the presence of moisture. Gradual corrosion and disintegration of the embedded lead will then follow. In such a case, and in all other cases, the embedded portion should be coated with epoxy, varnish, asphalt, or pitch.

Zinc
Zinc is highly reactive with alkalies and will deteriorate to some degree upon contact with fresh concrete and/or mortar. The reaction is limited due to a corrosive film that forms on the outer layer of the zinc. It protects the underlying metal from further reaction. Zinc will not react with dry, seasoned concrete and/or mortar. Embedded zinc will react with moisture and calcium hydroxide to produce calcium zincate. Zinc corrosion may also occur when galvanized iron, in the form of flat or corrugated sheets and rebar, comes in contact with fresh concrete and/or mortar. Galvanized iron is coated with zinc, and will react with moisture and chlorides in the concrete and/or mortar to produce zinc chloride. The result is expansion and cracking of the concrete and/or mortar. The metal should be protected with epoxy, varnish, asphalt, or pitch.